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| Allegations have been made that a large group of volunteers were very recently forced to resign from ECFR. Disturbingly, it appears as if ECFR personnel initiated unsolicited contact with the volunteers' employer to express "concerns" for the safety and well-being of these volunteers. This led to a mass exodus of capable and qualified volunteers. |
"I am not into politics, I just want to serve the community while I am here. What I am sharing with you are just the facts and so that's why I'm sharing them with you--because some things have happened that are not right and some of the other volunteers suggested I share this information with you and administrator Gilley." said the young man across from me with whom I had spoken over the telephone the day before.. "It's not right what they have done, and hopefully by letting the policy makers and the administrator know about this-- the issue can be fixed for the next group of volunteers." he said.
This young man, who asked to remain anonymous, will be leaving Pensacola this month. He has been here over the last 11 months in training. While here, his goal was to serve the community during his down-time as a volunteer firefighter with ECFR. "Not only was I able to become certified between April of 2019 and September of 2019--I was able to get dozens of my counterparts to sign up to volunteer as well." he stated. "I really enjoyed running calls with ECFR--let me be clear about that." he stated emphatically.
Beginning in September, upon his certification, he began to volunteer at Station 7 in Ferry Pass. He was running calls and really enjoyed the opportunity to serve in this capacity while here. "My family is out of state so instead of just going home each day after work, I wanted to do something for the community and becoming a volunteer firefighter was a great fit" he explained.
But this great situation came to a screeching halt in early January.
"Something changed and me and all the guys I recruited to serve with me were told we had to resign."
I asked, rhetorically, why? Why in the world would ECFR try to push dozens of young, physically able and motivated volunteers to resign? Why would they do this when we see on TV, in the PNJ, and online the trope of "we don't have enough volunteers" and "volunteers are not reliable?"
Then the young man went on to detail some cringeworthy anecdotes about the way he saw volunteers treated as the relationship soured between the paid firefighters and the volunteers.
"We would walk into (station 7) and be like 'hello gentlemen' and the career firemen that were there would not even look at us, they wouldn't even acknowledge our presence--maybe they might grunt-but they would not even look up at us." he stated. "It got to a point where we didn't feel welcome or appreciated. At one point, I was told I could not drive one of the vehicles, even though I had become fully qualified and was permitted to do so. A supervisor with ECFR heard me on the radio and called down to the station to say 'you can't drive that vehicle.' My volunteer chief went to bat for me, and they had it out over the phone. It was pretty shocking and by the time they got it figured out and that I was entitled to drive this vehicle--I just wanted to go home for the day at that point."
"Several volunteers put in for transfers to other stations, but these requests were flatly denied." he stated.
"I watched other volunteers, ones that are fully certified, be told they could not ride on trucks with the career crews." he said.
Eventually, many of the men that had volunteered did resign--but this particular young man would not. That's where the story gets particularly concerning to me. "Personnel from ECFR called my employer and my boss's boss to include the safety officer and expressed concern for my 'safety' if I continued to volunteer for the county on my 'free time.'" he stated. Then, I saw some of the same men who pushed out all my volunteers get on the news and say 'we are short on personnel'--which is total BS." he stated.
"I did not just do this without any thought at all---I had permission to do this from my direct supervisor. But the fact that they called a higher-up to suggest me and my peers not volunteer--that was just too much to let slide-so that's why we are talking, that's what I want you to know before I leave. I'm not in a position to challenge the higher-ups that are my bosses--but someone should find out why ECFR called them--I mean--riding a motorcycle to work is more dangerous. Scuba diving is more dangerous. There are a lot of things that are a lot more dangerous that me and my peers do."
"Will you look into this and fix it for the next group of volunteers?" He asked me as we finished lunch.
Yes is the answer to that question.
Janice Gilley has been made aware of this incident, she has met and spoken to this individual, and she has engaged appropriate staff to launch an investigation into this matter.
Coming up in part II--other serious allegations of mistreatment of volunteers and a total curtailment of training opportunities that are preventing able and willing volunteers from earning certification to volunteer with ECFR. All of this will be explored in depth, and we will get to the bottom of this.
Unbelievable! And the guys have the nerve to run these Military volunteers out and then complain about manpower shortages. You talk about defrauding the taxpayer! This needs to be investigated and punished! I would not ever accept their union’s endorsement. I hope you won’t. This all sounds criminal. And all for more money in their pockets! There is no amount of money available for their greed !
ReplyDeleteNot surprised. They now believe they can do anything because the union and their “what will it take” campaign is able to be pushed by many FF employees without regard to County policy.
ReplyDeleteLast week’s WEAR report wasn’t even done by the acting Fire Chief. I’m sure it’s because his smart remarks and temper is better kept out of the media. But they chose the biggest anti-volunteer to do it. This trading captain does everything he can to block volunteer applications and training. I’m sure he played a major role in the situation you are reporting.
Another "employee" going straight to the politican looking for reelection, I mean answers. Why are you referring them to the proper chain of command if the have a problem?
ReplyDeletehttp://www.northescambia.com/2020/02/area-fire-departments-take-part-in-live-burn-other-training-saturday
Same ones right?
Commissioner, I’ll translate the above, go through the chain when it shows the Union is being thuggish with volunteers. Let the leadership handle it through the chain of command, like the military. That sounds reasonable, until you understand that, unlike the military, there’s a Union involved. See, they want huge raises and don’t question them. See, the military has no union, hence no vicious attacks on social media against elected leaders. You commissioner, must endure my union attack on social media, outside the chain of command. But, if a young Marine Officer tells the truth to you after being bullied by union thugs, that’s outside the union chain of command, that’s bad. He should go only to the union that bullies him see? So the union can deep six the complaints. See? Understand.
DeleteAnonymous 9:59: Yes, I showed up to the "interview" they conducted with all of the candidates in my race. I didn't go in there and pander to them and I know they don't like that. I told them I would NOT raise taxes and that we are/were in bargaining but that I felt certain they would receive a pay increase like they have received for each of the past 3 years that I have been on the board. Make no mistake though--they were never going to endorse me. Four years ago, they didn't even call me or talk to me and instead they just endorsed one of my opponents who went on to be defeated in the election (he came in 2nd). This time around, I guess they are endorsing a different opponent, not the one they endorsed last time. I believe they are going the wrong direction, and the guy they endorsed this time around will be the bronze medalist LOL. Maybe he won't even make the podium because as I am walking door to door and people are telling me I have their vote--they all to a person say "who is that other guy running?" with looks of bewilderment on their faces. It is funny. Nope, the paid fire union guys they will only endorse candidates that kiss the ring and tell them what they want to hear--e.g. "Yes I'll raise taxes" and "We need an all-career force no more volunteers!! Yeah, I'm not the guy that will ever say or do either of those, but it looks like they found someone who did.........
ReplyDeleteHonestly commissioner, I’m sick and tired of reading and being called by you and the rest of your crew or posse a union thug. Just because we are young firemen or a paid first responder doesn’t make us a union thug. Speak for yourself, you sound more like a thug and internet bully when you get on this blog and get on Facebook and start to run your mouth. The leadership here in escambia starting with you commissioner sucks and is horrible. You make the moral here horrible, you don’t see the value in your employees at all. And instead of being a leader and being a bigger adult here in these situations you just continue to add to the drama. It seems you really enjoy the drama but Truthfully the drama gets annoying and old after a while. Will the drama ever end? We’re not here for the drama. We’re just here to devote 30 years to this county, do our job and be the best firemen emt we can be and provide the best services we can for the citizens of escambia county, NOT JUST BELUAH. You talk a big game for Beulah and the volunteers but you have other fire houses that fall in your district other than station 2 and not once have you tried to make contact with those other firehouses. Only station 2. Truly sad, and upsetting as a employee. Your supposed to be a leader but your absent. Your only present where you want to be present and you only speak when you want to be heard. The rest of us are just 2nd class citizens to you apparently. So please Stop calling us union thugs stop classifying us as if we were gang members. If you have a problem with us. Then address us, don’t go out and try to shame us or rant on social media cause that’s not what a true leader does. It seems Your only tough behind a keyboard. But whatever the sad reality is escambia will always be a minor league team cause the leaders including you can’t see the big league picture. All you have here right now is a farming system for young firemen to jump start their careers, cause you have no intentions commissioner of keeping them around. Train them up, invest money into them, gain experience and end up losing them to a bigger team. And the process starts all over like a never ending cycle and the only people that are truly losing in this situation, are your citizens and your county.
DeleteI’ll translate the post above for you Commossioner, do what we tell you and if not, the Union will attack. See, we don’t pay what San Francisco CA does, so you’re not a leader. When you open the beach on Perdido Key, you’re meddling outside your district. If you don’t go to my fire station, you are ignoring the county as a whole. I’m a Union thug. You will never please me until you raise taxes to pay me the highest wages in America. More than soldiers, more than correctional officers. If not, I’ll blog against you. And don’t you dare question us. If you do, you’re not a leader. If you break under our thug pressure, I’ll call you a leader. Stand firm Commissioner.
DeleteThis has been happening for years. The paid firefighters, union members, have been pushing out the volunteers to make room for more paid positions. This is one of the reasons for the budget shortfall
Delete^ no the reason for more paid positions is because people have literally died, and had their houses burn down without responses from the volunteer station they had in their district. If the volunteers had done their duty “for free” and showed up when the call came in, there would be no need for paid firemen.
DeleteCommissioner, this is just incredible. Everyone has witnessed the animosity towards the volunteers that has even been displayed on comments to this blog and other Facebook posts. The email that was leaked about having to cut down on manpower and recalled after the fact, now being a reality according to ECFR.... makes you wonder if this isn't indeed manipulation on their part to sway public opinion and create a false emergency to sway the Board and Administration.
ReplyDeleteMy suggestion, fire the senior team in ECFR for their lack of planning in allocating sufficient resources and manipulating those same resources to forward their agenda. With everything that we the taxpayers have had to witness out of this group this takes the cake. Do I believe what this young man is alleging, you damn skippy I do.
Nailed it! Spot on! Same game those thugs have been running for years! I say definitely clean house at the top of fire leadership! (There is none) Maybe citizens of Escambia County need to give them a vote of no confidence! It’s time! Way past!!!!!
DeleteIf volunteers are resigning, then there is a leadership problem. Look at neighboring Baldwin County and they are almost all dedicated volunteers. I would also suspect the Firefighter Union wanting rid of them too. I was a volunteer almost all my life in Alabama and I take exception to volunteers are unreliable and can't be counted on. I have volunteered in the Birmingham area with paid firefighters with a very good Chief that made us all equal and our officers had the same standing as a paid one. I also worked in Baldwin County, Alabama and did mutual aid with volunteers with Myrtle Grove and Interrarity Point and there was nothing wrong with those volunteers and they gave their all. I think if Escambia County is having a problem with volunteers, I would look straight at the top leadership and the union. The union has heartburn because they are crying that they are underpaid. My thing is that there are departments that make more so why not apply to work there than to muddy up the water here. I don't feel sorry for them at all. This makes me more than angry. If I was not 65 years old, I would go right now to Bellview to volunteer.
ReplyDeleteCommissioner Bergosh, I have never met you personally but I know your record and your interest in the district. You have my vote.
ReplyDeleteBack in the day the union just tied blocks to people and threw them off the docks. This time they put in a PRR on an outspoken citizen to try to intimidate.
ReplyDeleteWhat next, horse heads in the bed.
On the linked north escambia story those are all Alabama departments except Century. Century is a combo department with paid crews 7-4 during the day and volunteers nights and weekends.
ReplyDeleteI truly enjoyed my time as a volunteer. I worked and stayed with the career crew. Ate with them, trained with them and was just another one of the crew. With a military background I was impressed to see the leaders of the department work so smoothly with me volunteering. I knew there were going to be some boundaries, as there should be but I was there to help and I was being utilized in that capacity.
ReplyDeleteFrom the beginning I knew I had to work to gain the respect of the career crew. In the end it is their firehouse. They are there 24/365 and I was only a guest. You have to respect that as a volunteer and utilize a proper chain of command every day three the career crew. I couldn’t just do whatever I wanted to do without first checking with the the acting Lt. The firehouse is a place to fit in, socialize, fallow norms, joke, clean, train, and work hard.
I don’t buy anything this volunteer says and I would urge anyone to expect another side to this story.
Commissioner Bergosh, I just sent the following email.
ReplyDeleteAs you know, I have been tracking this stuff in Public Safety for a year now. And trying to raise the red flag as best as can as to how poor leadership has been driving thugs tactics and divide and conquer that is ripping our first responders and the County apart.
I don't think it's Fire Union that is coming up with this crap. This smacks of selfish leadership, from their own Fire heads, and from the D2 office, driving this crap.
Anyway, here's my email in which I ask whether all of the documentation I put in on wonkiness per the Fire leaders actuallly mattered. And this doesn't even touch on the illegal attempt at EMS training procurement one of the higher-ups was driving, etc.
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Escambia Fire
1 messageMelissa Pino Sun, Mar 1, 2020 at 7:42 PM
To: Janice Gilley , Chips Kirschenfeld , Jana Still , Laura Coale , Alison Rogers , Charlie Peppler , Chief John Williams , Chief Craig Ammons , Chief William Powell , Keith Morris , Bob Dye , Greg Marcille SAO , Lawrence Keefe US Attorney , "Governor DeSantis, Citizen Services" , "Inspector General, State of Florida" , Florida AG Civil Litigation , ucr@fdle.state.fl.us, John Dosh
Cc: District 5 Steven Barry , Lumon May , Jeff Bergosh , Robert Bender , Jim Little , Chorus Nylander , William Reynolds , Rick Outzen , Jeremy Morrison , Teresa Hill <1080edge@gmail.com>, John Singley , Larry Downes , Michael McCormack , Tracy Olson McAdams , Kevin Wade <1kevinwade@gmail.com>, Melissa Pino
To: Escambia Administration, HR, Communications, Legal, Fire Division Leads, Ethics Office, Risk Management, Jail/Corrections, SAO, US Attorney, IG, AG, FDLE
cc: BOCC, media, concerned citizens
Dear Ms. Gilley et al,
The scenario Jeff Bergosh released on his blog today is really not surprising to any of us who have been following the Public Safety debacle in Escambia:
http://jeffbergoshblog.blogspot.com/2020/03/a-story-that-must-be-told-part-i.html
So, it seems from the content of the blog that there will be an investigation.
Forgive me if I'm not holding my breath.
In addition to this recent debacle, Ms. Gilley, can I please inquire whether there are investigations ongoing per documents I have turned over to you on the following per Fire:
--Higher ups not logging personal time
--Conflict of interest on paid training
--Violations of County vehicle policy
--Potential procurement illegalities leading back to the way back machine, as when those engines back in the day got an envelope ripped up for another bid. With the result that the other company stripped its bells and whistles, was allowed to resubmit low, and then after the parade the engines got driven back over into Alabama to put the bells and whistles back on, per change orders.
Anything moving with those docs I sent?
Thanks so much,
Melissa Pino
Steven Barry Lumon May Jeff Bergosh Robert Bender
Nick Gradia
I think options need to be explored to recruit, train, and Initiatives to motivate volunteerism in this county. I have yet to see any real proposals to retain, recruit, train, initiatives from the board or fire admin staff. My hope is this spurs the county to direct some changes and requires proposals to come to the board. The next fire Chief should have experience in recruiting and should not just have volunteer on their resume, but actually be in a position in some kind of way in the past 5-10 years. Volunteers are cheap, and could be used effectively throughout the county, even if it’s for medical responses. Another union chief who has bounced around 6 times isn’t gonna work out.
ReplyDeletehttps://www.governing.com/columns/smart-mgmt/col-fire-departments-rethink-delivery-emergency-medical-services.html
ReplyDeleteAnonymous 12:35--
ReplyDeleteFirst off, you are ignorant, unaware, or deliberately lying...perhaps it is a combination of the three. Number one, I have been to the stations in my district, not just station 2. Ask Jim Allen at Bellview if I have not stopped by there. Ask Robert Jordan, Dexter Beasley, or Dale Berrian if I have not stopped in at Myrtle Grove. You are wrong in what you say and you lie about me. I will call you out when you lie. Next, you say you are tired of me calling you a "union thug." I have never said that--go find anywhere that I have used that term...mice try, but again, you are lying. Finally--you have an awfully depressing, dystopian view of the situation here. The fact of the matter is we have less than a handful of openings for firemen here at the moment. Check with HR if you want, you'll see I tell the truth unlike you who lies. Yes, we have turnover. Yes, that is costly when it happens. But here is the thing: Who are you and who are we to tell a young man or woman he or she has to stay here? Of course we would like that, but these folks are not indentured servants. If the grass is greener in Atlanta, Tampa, New York, or Los Angeles---go get 'em tiger! We can't pay what those big cities pay----so folks will do what they have to do for themselves and their families. Meanwhile, if a young man or woman starts a career here in the fire service or ems or corrections----and if they work a full career---they will enjoy an excellent retirment of 75% of their high 5 years and a significant payout if they go an additional 5 years in DROP--add in the sick time and leave they can sell back at the end of their careers, and that could be $300,000.00 in today's dollars. It is a package unparalleled in the vast majority of private companies locally and I suspect you know this. So no, you will not get rich in public service but if you make it a career you will have excellent health insurance, a platinum retirement of 75-90% of your pay for life upon retirement in your late 40s - early 50s--and you can live comfortably here in this area and if you are discerning about your choices in housing, etc. you can live here very affordably. I'd suggest that's why we have few openings in the fire service and fill the jobs quickly. We appreciate your service and dedication to the community--but you don't control the budget--the leadership does. So if you run off qualified volunteers and I find out about it---it is getting looked into. Because that costs us money. Now, hopefully, you get where I'm coming from Anonymous.
Anonymous March 1, 7:36PM,
ReplyDeleteSir, first off let me say thanks for your service to our community, and to our nation, it is appreciated. Now let me also add that as a volunteer you are an essential part of the ECFR team, just as important and just as deserving of recognition as such. I differ in the opinion it is their house and you being a guest. Not so, because you are a part of the team and should be treated as such. Doesn't matter that they are there more hours than you in a days time. You are there when you can be, and that is important, matters, and is your contribution from the heart. Thank you for that.
You said "I knew there would be some boundaries", I feel there shouldn't be any difference between you and full time. If you have certifications then you should be allowed to do the same things full time are allowed with the same certifications, no difference. Otherwise what would motivate others to seek those?
Lucky for you that your experience didn't match what the young man, and others I might add, have experienced in the department. I have seen posts from other volunteers on social media that depict an experience different from yours. It is time to look into the situation and make the necessary changes to foster an all inclusive atmosphere so that other volunteers don't feel like inferior or unwanted "guests". They are not guests, they are teammates, period.
I guess some food for thought. We have to be honest with ourselves, we live in one of the poorest and most rural areas of the state. Hence, I believe, we must rely on volunteers to supplement the career in the County. Rural areas will never have the financing that high density areas do. It is simple economics. Even though I left ECEMS in 2003, I still spoke with FF and EMS at the beach virtually daily through 2015. Yes, I have heard all of the rumors of volunteer mistreatment. However, I have never actually witnessed it. Hence, I can't speak to it. However, what about this...1. Task Career FF with optimally training all Volunteers and make that training readily available on a set recurring annual calendar. 2. Implement a policy that the only way to join the Career ECFR is to be recruited in from the Volunteer side of ECFR. Done. I tend to believe that when Career knows that the only ones being considered for hire are the ones they trained as volunteers, they will show a lot more interest. They are their future teammates and they are investing in them. Further, when potential FF know the only way to career here is through volunteer, maybe there will be more interest in volunteering. I believe we desperately need them.
ReplyDeleteFire the Chief !!! Never mind the county still hasn't replaced the last one. These are the types of things that happen when their isn't proper leadership the interim Chief can't do it all. Wouldn't be surprised to see him fired for this.
ReplyDeleteThe way I hear it he’s a complete moron so yeah fire him. He’s not Fire Chief material anyway. Never has been! ...and the reason your organization can’t keep a Chief is because of this kinda stuff. Crazy...right? But true. All those union and higher ups think they deserve top dollar for causing problems. Not!!!!
DeletePART 1:
ReplyDeleteWith all do respect commissioner, I’m not here to argue with you, disrespect you or call you a liar or change anything in operation. At the end of the day, you are the leader. I’m not deliberately lying, I am simply addressing what I’ve seen, what I’ve been told and what I’ve heard coming from the mouth of volunteers. That you have addressed us or made the comment in the past of singling us out that are part of the fire department union as “union thugs”. Too bad we can’t launch an investigation into the matter like you. But, I can almost venture to say that you are biased towards your employees and a bully pushing career firemen out the door with poor support and poor funding. But, again this is all word of mouth and can be false. Even though the writing has been on the wall. The past has shown and others have said that you rather have volunteers over career firemen. That you do not support paid firemen or the fire union at all. You might say you like career and volunteer both in public, but actions sometimes speak louder than words and it seems and it has shown before you are very one sided on the subject. So you can see where I’m coming from and why its hard to question the comment, under the circumstances and background. But, Im glad to hear though that you have spoken to Jim Allen and have paid a visit to those hard working men and women of Bellview. Along with the hardworking men and women of Myrtle Grove. On the other hand, the truth of the matter is you currently have 6 vacancies for firefighters that are not being filled and don’t have plans on filling them as of right now with the continued budget crises and minimum staffing going on. We are at 3 man company’s instead of 4 putting your employees and your citizens at a higher risk cause you can only get so much done with a 3 man company vs a 4 man company as OSHA 1910.134(g)(4) states in their two in, two out rule. It has been explained before the need to have fully staffed trucks to allow for minimal loss of life and property. Since science has proven to us fires are burning a lot hotter and a lot faster today, time and man power is of the essence. Which if Escambia County wanted to go off of that standardization every fire truck and fire station would have 4 man company’s 24/7, 365. So if that was the case, you really have 18 spots vacant because there are still 4 career fire houses that operate currently at minimum staffing not just during a budget crises because once again Escambia county’s current budget/ infrastructure can’t afford a 4th fireman spread across 3 shifts.
PART 2:
ReplyDeleteThe other side of the problem though is getting any applicants willing to apply here, stay here and put 30 years of good motivated service into your department. A new starting firemen in ECFR starts at a rate of $10.79hr with no increases or step plan in place to be able to move up in your career as a firemen. Theres not even a driver operator position, the only promotable position here are lieutenant and chief. So you can join ECFR being a firefighter paid 10.79 and end your career as a senior firefighter in 30 years making the same10.79hr which is unheard of only because there is no step plan in place for the retention of your employees and growth of your department. The county can continue to grow as it has but if your infrastructure/ public safety department doesn’t grow or continue to advance alongside the county, all you will have is an overworked and overwhelmed department trying to play catch up with minimum staffing (like we currently are). The only increases you can receive at ECFR are cost of living wage increases which are usually 3% across the board which are given to all county employees (and are not given every year). Then with that increase always comes an increase in premium insurance rates at the same time and amount so at the end of the day, it balances itself out. No one joins this career field with the intentions of becoming rich, but we can’t be blind to the facts and the negligence. We are here in this position to ultimately serve the citizens of our respected county and answer the call when no one else will. Not once have I mentioned LA, New York, Atlanta or Tampa and etc. Overall, retention in this department is a big issue and the turnover rate is high for both fire and EMS. So the young first responders in a department like this are not leaving to big cities like you mentioned. Their going right across the street into your own backyard (Midway, Fort Walton, South Walton, Destin, and the list goes on) you don’t have to go far looking for a big league team that sees the value in their public safety and the value in their employees that are giving and spending 1/3 a year 30+ years of dedicated service total to your county department. At the end of the day I want the best of the best coming to save my child. I want the best equipment, trucks, tools, and the best experienced firemen coming to my emergency and looking out for my back. We don’t want revolving doors with new faces and trucks full of rookies all the time. I think we all understand unfortunately everything will always come at a price/ cost and I guess for some, safety is not of an importance till their the ones calling 911 or seeing their homeowner insurance rates go up. Its not a matter or a question of “will it happen” its always a matter of “when it happens” are we prepared to the best of our ability as a county to answer the call. When all of your citizens we serve pay for the same rate but don’t get the same services. Its a system that’s constantly failing. Some district fire companies have ALS capabilities, some have 3 man crews, some have 4 man crews, some have volunteers but at the end of the day the citizens all pay the same exact rate and are being treated differently. Their is no guarantee to what your getting when you call 911. Look at District 20, in Lillian. Station 20 has been shut down/ closed for 2 years but the citizens pay the same fire rate and have higher iso ratings and unfortunately nothing has been done about it, not even a foot in the right direction to get something funded for those citizens. All the mutual aid in the world is not going to save those citizens when the trucks are tied up in other areas on other calls. I say all this with the most respect and most of this I’m sure you are already aware of but now hopefully you understand where I’m coming from. Were not here for drama, were just here to work together for the best outcome, for a better future for our communities.
Here's the deal. What anonymous part 1&2 wrote is 100 percent correct. To add, the union is getting blamed for crap that isn't true. They're not running volunteers off. Volunteers are running themselves off cause the can't do what is expected of them. The good volunteers don't have any problems with career cause they're held accountable and do a great job. Hence don't get there poor little feelings hurt for getting a butt chewing. This isn't the school board. Lives are on the line. Same goes for career, if you ain't doing your job, sometimes it take a butt chewing. The volunteers on here posting crap and lies are just mad cause they're being held accountable for doing something wrong. I can promise you career isn't out to get volunteers. They have enough crap to worry about in this county. Once again Bergosh has brought up something to divide career/volunteers even more. Leaders don't divide, they get people to work together. The union is wanting better pay and better coverage for the people of Escambia. Also on the anonymous volunteer who wrote this email/letter, he didn't say he was told he couldn't volunteer cause he was a flight student and the Navy said they have to much invested in them to get hurt volunteering at a fire station. But once again it's the Union's fault per Bergosh. I appreciate the great work tearing the department apart instead of trying to be a leader and help fix it. Bad volunteers you can invite them for dinner and they ignore you, if you don't invite them you're bad guy. Good volunteers and career will show up eat/sleep and make fun of each other. It not about volunteers vs career. It about being held accountable.
ReplyDeleteJust look at the big ECFR headlines on harassment investigation and see how many kept quiet and the union fought every step of the way to see that they “want to be held accountable”. The more they speak you here their true intentions louder and clearer.
DeleteAnonymous 3:56 has now given us the rest of the story and now it really stinks. So one of his buddies decided to drop the dime on a military pilot? In the same response he’s saying they want responsible and those who can be held accountable? Nothing meets that description better than our military pilots.
ReplyDeleteThis shows they truly will do anything to be rid of volunteers. I bet their not dropping a dime on their buddies who have affairs, cheat the time clock or anything else, but it’s their moral obligation to do this to a volunteer.
Wow, a whole lot of keyboard cowboys on here with no testicular fortitude. A whole lot of anonymous commentators. Keep up the good work Mr. Bergosh.
ReplyDeletePART 3:
ReplyDeleteI guess you can choose to ignore this problem, and ignore these facts commissioner and let the problems I stated above continue to escalate, grow and snowball (like they have been). Whether you get elected or not this upcoming term this is an issue that has to addressed but nonetheless you can choose to ignore the issue. Sweep it under the rug and just let other commissioners that will eventually follow behind you, have to pick up the pieces you leave behind. Essentially picking up this mess. When at least we can be putting a foot in the right direction for pubic safety. Simply stating facts within 10 years you have at least 27 firefighters retiring and walking out the door with 30+ years of full dedicated service. Is the department or your administration ready to handle that gap looking forward to the future? Do you have a plan in place for retention? In 10 years a lot can happen, just look at Beulah and Escambia County in 10 years how much it has grown. You think in 2030 we’re going to be rolling out of our stations with some of the same fire trucks and equipment…. No, especially not with the shape our trucks are in currently. Do you or your administration even have a plan in place for maintenance and apparatus replacement, because the past has shown that you obviously didn’t have a plan in place when the old air packs were coming up on expiration. Just like you didn’t have a plan in place when Station 20 just “unexpectedly” shut down. The comments above and on Facebook from older gentleman stating they have no sympathy for ECFR career crews and the shape our equipment is in because they worked with even worse equipment back in their day. All I have to say to that comment is “Welcome to 2020”. There is no reason or excuse for why we have to live and operate like we are in 1970. Times have changed. But again you can choose to ignore that fact and continue to think, live and operate like we are in 1970. And to the hostility environment in public safety you can come experience that for yourself, see if it’s true or not. See for yourself if it is a hostile, stressful environment. Come sit in the back of an ambulance or come visit a busy fire house with sleepless nights of missed meals, half showers and learning to control your bowel movements in between our busy calls, serving the public (our people). It’s even more stressful when your commissioners or your “leaders” are deliberately ignoring the facts and needs in public safety. At the end of the day, this job is not easy and not meant for everyone. You can’t just wake up and say I want to be a Firefighter/ EMT today. That’s not how this works, ECFR volunteer or career is an elite team, an elite department and an elite group of individuals that hold this department and county to a high standard and high regard. We go to a lot of emergencies, and we take a lot of pride in it. This isn’t a job you can mess up and be like, “it’s ok”. When you mess up people get hurt and people can die and that’s just the reality of it. Like in a team atmosphere or environment? Your team mates are expecting when you step out on that field to have accountability, to have their back and know what your doing.
PART 4:
ReplyDeleteAs far as the retirement that’s a Florida state system, that is not a gift from you commissioner, you can’t just throw that around or in our face. But, yeah the fact is you can retire and earn 75% of the best 5 years averaged across your career at $10.79 an hour after 30 years of dedicated service. Which if you do the math at $10.79 an hour for a 5 year average your retirement is $23,306 average a year. You tell me commissioner if you can survive retired supporting a family with that salary, the answer is no especially not here in Escambia County, Florida. So your basically telling your first responders to go find a 2nd job, or go find another department. When its all said and done we love this job and our community, we love helping the public but we go into burning buildings, risk our lives and strain our bodies for 30 years in a understaffed, overwhelmed busy department, to potentially end up having cancer and a $23,000 salary. All we’re asking for commissioner is for you to take care of your employee first responders. Leadership starts with you so make this a safe, honest place where people want to come work and volunteer. Hostility starts with you commissioner, hostility towards your firefighters/ employees doesn’t help. Work with us for a better future. Start planning ahead for our communities so we can start being proactive instead of constantly being reactive to our problems in public safety. The only reason some of us stick around is hope. Hope that eventually things will get a little bit better.
Suck it up buttercup! Many and I mean many first responders and firefighters before you had second jobs. If you don’t like the pay go back to school and do something else! You always have a choice. If where you are ain’t working...MOVE! Unbelievable you young folk think you deserve it all.
DeleteThis is the problem with people like the comment above, still living in the past. the disconnect between the old generation vs young generation or even the first responders and the resident. The comment above definitely needs a reality check and to get with the times. You should really research how much schooling/ training you have to do now a days to even become a certified firefighter/ paramedic or a firefighter/ emt. it takes a special individual to do the work that we do, but you don’t see that. Your obviously willing to run off all those young first responders, instead of really fix the problems. If everyone would be able to do this job, then you would have more people signing up to do this job. But, aside from the fact, this career field is no longer a blue collar job but a white collar job. But again you wouldn’t understand that statement because you obviously don’t understand the behind the scenes of becoming a career first responder. The constant training physically and mentally and the constant stress to provide the best services to the citizen and let’s not mention the ptsd that comes along with this job. But go ahead and make your comments not all of us volunteer, some of us actually make this our lifestyle because this isn’t a choice for some of us. We are the hardest working county (#11 in the state per capita) and the lowest paid in the state out of 180+ fire departments. Does that make sense to you? Who wants to come work more for less, but it’s okay your willing to settle for mediocre employees cause all the young talented and motivated first responders are going to south Florida, working less and getting paid more. So, you don't see any problems with the way we operate over here in escambia county. You really think the system that is in place is a working system?
DeleteWhen is the BOCC going to get Administrator Gilley to eat that Frog and tell us if the DOH complaints and FDLE complaint were bogus or not? go to Ricks Blog. He articulated what EVERYBODY is waiting for. (Except mancrush dunderhill and prima donna girl and black hearts united.) State exactly why they don't have training and who is responsible for putting that on the agenda.
ReplyDeleteThey were bogus.
Delete7:08
ReplyDeleteThat needs to be published by the Administrator.
And what are people going to do when she does? The medical director has committed so many violations worthy of being terminated. Her civil suits has already proven that that many accusations against her were true. We in EMS are terrified. This county has built a culture where you do not dare say anything. No matter how bad something is you look the other way and move on. HR isn’t going to protect you, our admin can’t protect us, and Janice.....well she might just delete your position and show you the door. People really don’t understand how bad it is. How much stuff is really going on.
DeleteAnonymous 1-4
ReplyDeleteOkay, I agree with much of what you have stated in your very convoluted, longwinded comments to this post. But there are some clarifications in order. I have the list of 2019 firefighter wages reported to the IRS (what individuals will see on their W-2). So please do me a favor and save the $10.79 talking point. Nobody, not one firefighter that worked a full year in 2019 made only $10.79 per hour and you know this. Heck, there are a couple of firefighters that made big money (Not LT's either, FFs) One made $82K the other made $78K in total wages paid. Tiger Shark Kingpin the bowler who always is on facebook complaining made almost $90 K. Henry Rollins' look alike made $60K. I ought to post the whole list, so everyone in the community that pays these salaries will know the truth. Maybe I will. Meanwhile please, do not lie. Don't do it. 10.79 is the base rate, and there is built-in overtime, plus multiple other categories of special pay, extra pay, OT pay, etc. Now, I am not begrudging these men and women the salaries they earned; they obviously worked a lot of OT, etc. Good for them. But they are not poor, please stop with that lie. And the other thing you talk about with respect to the Florida Retirement System--yes that is a program developed by the state---but ESCAMBIA county taxpayers fund it. FULLY. So yes, that pension and payout is a very, very, very generous and costly benefit, hence the difficuly in folks getting a full-time FF job in Escambia County. Because people know it is a great job, and a great and rewarding career where you can earn a better than average salary if you stick with it for a career, with platinmum, subsidized Blue Cross health insurance for a family that costs out of pocket less than $275 month---plus a 75%-90% of "high-five" earning year retirement for life if you work 25-30 years....meaning you could feasibly retire in your late 40s with a retirement income greater than the average median income in Escambia County. Yes, it is a demanding, hard, and necessary job and yes we appreciate the men and women that do the job---but there are benefits that come along with it that exceed what even military retirees receive, those who work similarly long careers.......
Way to go commissioner! You should post their salaries to the public. This 10.79 was getting really old. I’ve been watching this thinking to myself...someone needs to call out those FF. I knew what they were making and how misleading their “what will it take” bs is. Amazing isn’t it. All the lies! It is a great retirement system if you work for the county and health insurance is top notch. Those two things definitely add up. But, you’ll never hear the truth from those firefighters their in to deep with all the lying they now have to stay their stupid course which is getting them nowhere!
Deletehttps://www.governmentjobs.com/careers/escambia/jobs/2674336/firefighter?utm_campaign=google_jobs_apply&utm_source=google_jobs_apply&utm_medium=organic
Delete^ above is the link, you can copy and paste, read it yourself and it goes to escambia county job employment page for a firefighter position so you can look for yourself. The facts are right there. 10.79 an hour is the base salary for a full time firemen and the base salary for a part time firemen is 12.79 an hour because their work week is a 45 hour work week instead of a 72 hour work week for a full time, so it averages itself out. The only reason why some firemen made a lot more this year on their salary is because they work their behind off and pick up alot of shifts. We only have Overtime because Escambia county can not fill positions so if the position doesn’t get filled what do you want to do? Not fill the position and continue to operate at minimum staffing putting us the firemen and the resident at risk? no so luckily we have brave first responders that are willing to pick up the overtime and sacrifice their family time to the job and county. their is no lying going on here. Only the lie you make up in your head. Below is some more information from the Job description link.
Supplemental Information: Employees that work a 56 hour work week will be paid at the rate of $10.79 an hour and those that work 45 hour work week will be paid at the rate of $12.49.
Anonymous 10:19am
DeleteHow old are you.....? Their stupid course? Call out those FF? “What will it take” bs? Lies? Those firefighters are the ones risking their lives everyday to keep our community safe. Their the ones that show up when you call 911 no matter how stupid you think they are. They’re there to rescue you out of a burning structure and even extricate you out of your car wreck. They're there to make you feel safe when you feel helpless. They’ll even pick up your grandmother off the floor and hold her hand at 2am just to make sure she’s ok. So you obviously have no respect for first responders and the hard work they do for our communities.
I know this blog is a little on the old side, but I wanted to point out something to anyone still reading reading at this point. This blog was about how a young Navy pilot was made to feel by the career firefighters of this county as a volunteer. Let me reiterate that, a VOLUNTEER, and in the replies on this blog is this shining example of the mentality of said career firefighters towards the volunteer staff.
ReplyDelete"Who wants to come work more for less, but it’s okay your willing to settle for mediocre employees cause all the young talented and motivated first responders are going to south Florida, working less and getting paid more."
And there it is folks, in all of it's stark reality, the mentality that the young man was reporting to the Commissioner. The attitude that volunteers are either "mediocre" or less. Notice how quickly the talk evolved to being about pay. Money, not the respect these volunteers are due, not the building of camraderie between the teams, not the recognition they are a valid and integral part of the team. All of that attention was diverted from the conversation as they don't want anyone to focus on anything but them and their issues.
The truth of the matter as I see it is, they don't want the volunteers around because it weakens their position at the bargaining table, and takes them out of the equation for OT etc. They are " mediocre" and career are the only ones fit to be firefighters, and at the firehouse. Thanks for proving the young mans point and cementing my belief he is telling the truth. This county is in trouble if this mentality is allowed to exist and continue, God Help Us All.......
McCormack, you completely took that sentence out of context and twisted it. Not once did that sentence go like that or mean what you just explained. The only problem between volunteer and career personnel is the one you just made up, twisted right now in your head and in the comment above. If you read thru the thread. No one belittles volunteers, from what I have witnessed we have great working relations and if the system works and citizens are content and pleased with the services they are receiving. Then there is no problem whatsoever. But you go around saying what you just said is the problem, stirring the pot. The problems stated above, are the problems as a whole. Not talking about volunteer or career. Simply talking about ECFR and public safety as a whole, has issues within the infrastructure that needs to be addressed but all you see is this close minded idea that you want it to be. Nobody here is separating, volunteer vs career. We are talking as one department. In order for the department to grow and continue to advance their has to be money involved. That is a simple fact, we can not deny. What I stated above about firemen leaving to other departments is a fact. Majority of our volunteers here in escambia are paid union firemen for other departments in other areas. Only reason they do not seek employment here in escambia is because of the facts stated above. We have volunteers that do great work. ECFR is a combination department and no one here is denying that. Nobody here not once has even mentioned OT or bargaining. You are just another person that loves the drama.
Deletehttps://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2015/09/04/05316abe-517c-11e5-933e-7d06c647a395_story.html
ReplyDeleteSome people see through Owens and the IAFF. Sad many don't especially on Underhill Propaganda site Escambia Citizens Watch Facebook.
Check your facts before you comment anonymous 12:38. ECFR is number 1 in the state per capita for structure fires. Last year ECFR ran a total of 270 working building structure fires, along with 166 working vehicle fires. Now you do the math there’s 365 days a year, and that’s a total of 436 confirmed working fires. That’s at least one fire a day. You tell me now how accurate that article you posted above is, now. Aside from those facts ECFR made a total of 4 grabs/ saves last year just in building structure fires. That’s not even including how many animals we pull out of building structure fires or how many people we pull out of vehicle wrecks. So you tell me where the lies are at. You tell me we’re not working hard. I can’t speak for the rest of the state of Florida but ECFR is working hard around the clock 365 days a year. When America is on shut down guess who’s still out there working and protecting the citizens and answering the calls, your firefighters. When your at home typing away on your keyboard and people are running out and panicking, guess who’s running inside, your firefighters. I’m not even going to get started on how we are the busiest fire department in the region but we’re on minimum staffing restrictions if that makes any sense. We’ve been working more with less.
Delete^ completely innacurate article when we’re talking about escambia county fire rescue. While yes there are less fires nationwide, and a lot of departments out there don’t fight a lot of fire, escambia county is still number one per capita when it comes to fires in the state of Florida. The average death rate per year from house fires varies from 2500 to 3500 for the last decade. And that is just fires alone. You do know that the fire department responds to thousands of different kinds of calls right? Or have you been living under a rock your whole life... Escambia county fire rescue is especially unique because they can respond to anything from a water rescue out in the gulf, to a cardiac arrest, to a structure fire, to a 15 car pile up on the interstate, to a huge brush fire in the northern part of the county, to thousands of different kinds of calls in between those. Again, that article is completely ignorant and if you, or anyone else believes that it applies to escambia county, then God speed because you can’t teach that amount of stupidity.
ReplyDeleteIt's an opinion piece dummy
ReplyDeletestruck a nerve?
maybe more will read it.
here's a FACT that berg is completely overlooking or ignoring, you decide. let's take a look at hours worked to make the money you so ridiculously vilify. you didn't mention that. also, STOP calling them VOLUNTEERS, they are PAID-ON-CALL. just so you are provided with factual data about hrly rates; a ff that has been here 5yrs makes $11.50 give or take a few cents. another ff that has been here 13yrs or so, $13.50 give or take a few cents. there are company officer's that have been here 20+- yrs that make around $20/hr. so tell me that is reasonable. what kills me is that y'all say, go back to school, find another job, go to another fire department. they are going back to school, they do have other jobs, they have gone to other fire dept's. ff's w/ less than 3-4yrs have gone to other dept's. for a ff to try an transition to another career after 10yrs or 20yrs, its pretty difficult. there is quite a bit of planning that has to occur. it must be nice to sit from your ivory tower and make $70-90K/yr plus perks for a part time job. but you say, it's a full time job! maybe so, who among the dais has a second job or should I say, your job prior to being elected. i'm sure you haven't given that one up. enjoy your moment in the sun for it shall not last long. you slam these emergency service employees like their below you, the only reason they are is you sit in your high chair. go to the firehouses and ems posts or public safety for that matter and talk with them. hear their struggles. understand what they do. there is no sympathy for you. you were elected to make the county productive, safe and efficient. the residents are still waiting.
ReplyDeletelastly, you'd rather pay $6k to a paid-on-call ff than $30-50k, closer to $100k i suppose given the benefits and all, for a career ff. i get the economics of that. what you fail to realize is that the response from a paid-on-call ff is hit or miss. it's not their fault. they have lives, other jobs, family, etc just like the career ff's. career ff's provide a guaranteed response regardless if it's from further than 5 miles, which can be the case sometimes due to call load and region they respond to. keep sticking your head in the sand and keep spinning the facts. sorry, you may not spin them but you don't provide all of them.