We need a leader. We desperately need a leader to step forward and take charge of the ECFR and fix multiple issues. We all watched what happened with the respirators fiasco--and hopefully EVERYONE saw the rapid and unified response from the BCC as we voted to spend $2.9 Million to fix that lingering issue about which we were just made aware.
We support firefighters, I support all first responders. This is why this current situation is so damn frustrating.
Now I know that department has been in turmoil over the last several years, as issues of harassment have been dealt with and as leaders have resigned.
But now more than ever we need a leader to step up in ECFR, a new chief, to get things under control and bring a unified message to the board so that we can be a part of the solution.
And that does not mean I will genuflect to a proposal thrown at me demanding a 70% year over year budget increase complete with the demand that we raise taxes to fund it. Nope. We need to be better and we need to be smarter.
And for my vote--We MUST treat volunteers as equals and not as fourth class citizens. We must embrace them and support them and appreciate them. For my vote, any 5-year plan I support will include robust line-items for cultivating, recruiting, equipping, and training volunteers as well as paid fire staff. It has to be both.
Meanwhile, the devastating negative impacts of the leadership vacuum at ECFR continue to manifest themselves. Just today, just this morning as I am about to prepare to go to church, I am told of new ways in which volunteers are being squeezed.....From one volunteer, just this morning.
"Well apparently there was a staff meeting yesterday with the career crews and it was said that volunteer trucks cannot roll without a crew of at least 3 certified. And battalion chiefs and career officers are being told to cancel volunteers even if we are way closer. this is all being done by the career crews at some meeting somewhere we knew nothing about and had no one there to represent the volunteers."
A different individual contacted me today and said this---and this is going to quickly become a special area of interest for me--equipment. Volunteers should not be schlepping for beat-up, old, or used equipment. They should have everything they need to do their job safely but as this individual reports below, this is not the case:
"at this point what are they (county/career) going to do is target me at this point
however they have targeted every volunteer to try everything they can to remove
hold back or push us out.
On
8/3/19 the volunteers were at station XXX from 1300 til around 2100hrs thru the
day which was busy we ran a forced entry call we was cancelled by ems wasn’t
needed then got called to a gas odor call turned out gas line outside was
leaking. (We have no gas detector on XXXX). So we called XXXX for
gas detector, then we were dispatched to a allergy call on 57th and
Jackson.
Responded
to these calls as a crew of 2 certified and 1 trainee. Which we have since I been
in the county now for 3 yrs.
However
last night we was responding to a medical alarm crew of 2 certified and 2
non-certified (trainees) and was almost there when XXXXXXXXXXXX cancelled
us and told us to return that XXXX would go to that call. We called XXXXX when we
got back to station and he informed us that the new directive is now for
volunteers to run/replace the career company that we have to have a crew of 3
certified on the truck. Unless the career company is on a call then we can go
to the call without a crew of 3 certified. So with that being said without a
crew of 3 at all times at the station with career personnel we as volunteers
will not run calls unless the career company is stuck at a call. What i
don’t understand is our trainees (non-certified) have their emergency first
responder and they're told
they can go to medical calls as long as they have
there cpr and keep it up to date. I understand that responding to fire calls
there should be 3 certified on the truck but a medical call which they have
taken the required classes for now we can respond unless 3 certified for fire
or career company is on a call. Seems more like a plan so that the career
companies gets to take every call unless we have 3 certified. Because if they're already on a call then we can respond to a call with a crew of one certified
and 1 non certified as long as they're on a call. We as volunteers have the same
training as the career personnel.
But
here is a couple issues as I stated before we as volunteers have less than adequate
equipment. For example the career company got the ladders off our truck so we
have nothing but an attic ladder. Because theirs failed inspection and we have
no idea when we are getting ladders back. We have no gas detector for gas
related calls for the volunteers truck and we have no TIC (thermal image
camera) to check for hot spots on fire related calls so we can’t accurately
check for a fire to be out or for gas not to be in a home because of this.
We have asked for these items and told there is none available for us. Not even
used ones that have been seen In the warehouse by multiple people. Just seems
like they don’t want us to have the equipment to use. Because as I stated it’s
like they are just trying to hold us back and push us out. So in reality even
if we have a crew of 3 or even 5 certified on the truck we still couldn’t
respond to a gas odor call and be adequate. Or even check for a fire behind a
wall without the proper equipment. It’s just got to the point that seems like
no one in the county wants volunteers any longer when it comes to
administration and career personnel. We have a non certified now that has
completed everything and is just waiting on admin to send his stuff to the
state to get his cert but they keep emailing him asking for certificates that
he has already turned in multiple times to them and it’s like they have lost or
just can’t find them for some reason or another. Maybe hoping he just gives up
and walks away out of frustration. The public I don’t think really understands
the money they could save by getting volunteers in the stations and having a 12
hour career company vs a 24 hr career company and also save some jobs for
career personnel. But I see the career personnel pushing out the volunteers so
they can show the public there is no volunteers and that’s why they need more
money. Heck we would be up there overnight but we as volunteers have no where
to sleep as the career guys when they came in took out the bunk beds and got
rid of the stuff so volunteers could no longer stay so now we have no where to
sleep and have asked about letting us have the career lieutenant room to use as
a bunk room to save money he could sleep with his guys and we would be able to
use that room and the only money that would have to be spent is for beds, it
already has power heat and air so simple quick solution. But that was shot down
and we was told that wouldn’t happen because the career lieutenant needs there
own space away from there firefighters. Don’t really understand that we as volunteers
like being around each other. But anyway just wanted to get this out there and
how I think it’s completely unfair and how the admin and career personnel have
been unfair to the volunteers."
24 comments:
Again, one sided story taken as law. You, sir, are adding fuel to the fire by your ignorance. There are career companies without gas detectors also. Whomever is your source is nothing more than a disgruntled member who does not get their way. Why not ride as a 4th member on the career engine. Why not come up and spend time with the crews instead of hiding in a separate room to distance yourself. Again, Bergosh Blog of one-sided banter and controversy. You are constantly complaining about the PNJ's political slant, yet you ride in the same car as they do.
What more leadership do you want? There have been 5 chiefs in 10 years, who either left from frustration or impotence brought on by the lack of vision from the same BoCC that "supports" all first responders. You claim to care about them, yet do not want to bring them up to par for sake of your political claims of "No New Taxes."
Keep the hate spewing, election season is right around the corner.
Anonymous--it isn't hate spewing it is truth telling and you are obviously a union acolyte. I support first responders, but that does not mean I genuflect on command and raise taxes and swallow the 5-year plan and forced tax increases because you say so. It means I ask questions and get to the bottom of things independently and I do talk to both sides paid and volunteer--just because you don't know about it doesn't mean it isn't happening. I have asked the administrator to look into the treatment of the volunteers and to come up with a plan to integrate volunteers with paid staff, as has been successfully done in several stations (Bellview and Ferry Pass)---because I support ALL first responders and Firefighters. That said, I won't stand by and let volunteers be run out or treated like 4th or 5th class citizens, do you hear me? Do you hear that? And you are right, election season is right around the corner and I am ready to rock and roll, just as I always do. Maybe you should come out of hiding and run against me and see how that turns out for you.
Yet you dont publish the other side of the story. You have a volunteer sending you information that you take as law. Your cowardous to address the issue at hand, with only a "no new taxes" response, will only perpetuate a generational issue of lack of foresight from the dias.
I'd run, but I'm too busy working for the school board. Thanks in advance.
Minimum staffing for a career response is 3 certified firefighters. Volunteers need to be treated as equals, so the same minimum staffing rules need to apply to them.
Why did people from Palm Bay and Orlando laugh and ask does Escambia have anything left in the Fire budget?
Sorry but I can’t agree with you on having uncertified people run emergency calls. I pay taxes for a reason and I want a trained and certified personnel taking care of my family. I don’t get the part about the ladder, why did they have to give to career? Is there no money to give paid career staff equipment? I hear these guys are getting paid 10$ a hour to put their lives on the line and you’re treating them like second class citizens. I’m disgusted by this and I hope you fix the fire depts budget it sounds terrible.
Commissioner. I gave the County almost two decades of volunteer service. I volunteered alongside career crews for the last five years. Was there friction at times, and sometimes disagreements? You bet! Was there friction among volunteers, I would say even more so because there were too many just wanting the t-shirt, but not show up to train and check off equipment. I'm not sure who these individuals are you are getting your information from but I'm pretty certain I used to be in the same department with them, and they are nothing but trouble makers. I about spit out my food when you made the comment you "only heard about the airpaicks a day ago". You must've forgotten the conversation you heard from the dias about two months ago where that was specifically mentioned! It appears you are more concerned with supporting one group (who I was a proud member of), instead of using the actual facts and supporting the organization at a hole. I used to tell my firemen that the rules and regulations were there to keep us and the public safe, which included minimum staffing on apparatus. What are we going to do if we show up when there's a fire around the corner with a crew of 2 certified firefighters? Nothing, because it is a suicide mission and we'll be doomed from the get go. If we try to make entry NIOSH would've fried us if something would've happened, and if we dont do anything the public would've been furious for a half a million dollar apparatus sitting in the driveway with no way of putting the fire out or pull somebody out. These individuals you are talking to, do not understand the safety and regulations concept. You do not understand these concepts or the need for funds to order all this equipment. mike weaver turned down requests for years even when I was still active. I know for a fact that a former fire chief informed all of the BOCC of the desperate need for additional equipment. Dont put the blame on this administration or career or volunteers. The blame falls in your court for putting campaign promises over sufficient funding and providing a budget that is sufficient for a department our size.
A lot of career guys were volunteers, yet only a handful of careers remembered where they came from and try and help volunteers to succeed or even join as a paid firefighter eventually down the line. The fact is most of you are scared of volunteerism because A) it scares you that you're expendable B) your pay raises and C) It hurts your pride a pride that both sides need to swallow to even start to help each other. Uncertified run with certified to get the knowledge and hands on experience I don't see the issue they won't go inside a fire first of all bit they sire can help with everything else. Lastly but not least Escambia County Fire from experience will cancel enroute volunteer crews with 3 or more certified, bring in an engine from another district just to be jerks the battalion chiefs along with several lieutenants do shun volunteers and that's why this is now a problem. Respect goes both ways and not everyone is a good cookie but where are we going to start the cooperation? It won't because you guys want more money.
You sir, are so misinformed it’s getting comical. Get the other side of the story before more puke runs out of your mouth!
Was that a threat Mr. Bergosh??
Volly’s want respect so bad....but they constantly talk bad about career firefighters, don’t use the chain of command properly, most don’t follow fire house rules, and when a new directive comes out, the career fireman questions them and the Volly gets in the career’s face...
This is the pot calling the kettle black. Respect is not given, it’s earned. You don’t get anywhere by casting stones against your OWN team! Follow the rules, follow fire house rules, directives, and maybe you vollys will feel more like a member.
Former Volly. Yep, you heard that right. 😏
Have you seen ECFRs Training ISO rating for 2019?
were expected to just stand by at station while y’all run a call???? That’s stupid to think anyone is gonna sign up to do station standby....while y’all accuse stations of not having volunteers. You can’t have it both ways. You run a lot of medical calls anyways and we’re all doing the same job.... with exception of a few companies being ALS. The rule is not only dumb but it hurts a citizen in need it of help. If last nights incident was true and that was a serious incident and seconds do count as y’all say... canceling help looks even more dumb and not well thought out
Uncertified let’s discuss that for a medical call there is no certified for say. The certified comes in for fire fighting for medical related calls the uncertified are capable and qualified to respond to the call they have the required classes and cpr. The uncertified part comes to fighting fires. So they will have a certified career crew tied up on a medical call and the volunteers at the station of say 2 certified and 2 non certified will end up getting the fire call which will not have the needed people to respond appropriately. When the volunteers could have responded to the medical call leaving the career company there to respond to that fire.
What did you change sides lol
Now now it seems that they will let volunteers respond to a citizen assist lift. They have no issue with that. Hmmm are they not wanting to waste there precious time with type of call, too good to go help someone off the floor. What happens if it turns out to be a medical call when we get there we radio the career company and leave the scene so they can handle. Ridiculous
Let this area be more efficient. Go to 10 or 12 hour shifts. You could then go from 150 people to 100 or so and use volunteers more effectively. Plus, less union nonsense. Also, make the firefighters live in Escambia county , I understand Uber union guy Gradient live in Pace. He pays no property tax where he works.
Fire has needed a leader for quite a while. FIRE CHIEFS are supposed to lead and protect all their people and keep them safe and build a team that's solid. If that's the case what happened? If Chief Grace had been doing his job instead of covering sexual harassments up and not being truthful about any of that or if Chief Nail was a reformer and has a tremendous track record both of these " stellar" men would have let the County Commissioners know the need for all that safety equipment to keep "Their" men safe. But you now know they were busy NOT being stellar and running the many games that has put fire where they are today! Looking absolutely stupid!!! Both men should be ashamed of the things they did to their own men and organization! Such disgrace. Such utter disregard for human life knowing the equipment was bad or as critical as mentioned on the radio with the union president. What the heck is going on here? Can anybody within fire say?This is like crazy town. I mean word on the street is fire is always having some internal problem within the ranks. But come on...could you guys just man up and speak the truth for once instead of blaming EVERYONE ELSE?
Forgive me for my ignorance in all of this but just because equipment is outside of its warranty does that mean it can no longer safely be used? Does everyone buy a new car every time their warranty is up? If the equipment is passing inspections and can be safely used it may not be a true emergency? If it is an emergency why has it not been brought very often up for the last 6 years since it has been out of warranty?
hang on there cowboy about Chief Grace. your fingers are writing checks your brain can't cash. grace was the scapegoat. weaver was the "man in charge" that let all that crap slide under the rug. Chief Nail is a stand up man. he rocked the ss minnow and all of the nail biters at ems got rattled and started pointing fingers and the then asst. county administrator jumped on it and the rest is history. make sure you have your facts before you start pointing fingers bub. grace and the previous chiefs during weavers reign, brought the budget and shortfalls up to weaver since he was the one who supposed to represent fire and ems at the budget meetings. his statements to the commish board was always, "we're doing fine". now you see that the truth has come to light. after all those years of weaver stating, "we're fine", the chickens have come to roost. the fire chief is/was not allowed to represent the fd in front of the commish. weaver took to them what he wanted them to hear. that's why fire is in the shape its in financially. and why ems lost $6mill.
as far as uber union guy gradia goes, he lived in pace well before he was hired in escambia. you people spew such ignorance its laughable. our commish board has no clue as to how fire/ems work with the exception of maybe 2 of them. one gets all his "facts" from the PAID-ON-CALL FF's and nowhere else.
the public pays for a certain service and they expect the most effective and guaranteed means to receive the benefit. imagine this if you will, let's have ecua use "volunteers" as their refuse collectors. you'd never know when your garbage would be picked up. maybe 25% of the time, maybe 50%, maybe 100% of the time. you 'd never know what day either. no one has suggested that the county get rid of PAID-ON-CALL FF's. if they want to be treated as the career crews are treated then they must adhere to the same standards and be disciplined the same way for the same issues that arise within their ranks. it's really not "their" ranks. its, ECFR Combination FD. so you see, they are part of the combi dept. they should be held to the same sog's the career crews are held to; uniforms, facial hair, training, etc, etc. and disciplined the same way, they are not. with that being said, there are quite a few PAID-ON-CALL FF's that adhere to the sog's. they don't seem to have any issues with the career crews. funny, ain't it.
lastly, if you have issue with the term PAID-ON-CALL FF's, then you need to grab a merriam-webster's and thumb to the v section and look up the word volunteer. here let me help you out, Volunteering is generally considered an altruistic activity where an individual or group provides services for no financial or social gain "to benefit another person, group or organization". notice the phrase "no financial gain"? i leave you with one word and its definition, stipend, A stipend is a regular fixed sum of money paid for services or to defray expenses and it is often distinct from an income or a salary because it does not necessarily represent payment for work performed. get informed, get educated.
Wow somebody is a bit testy aren’t ya. No more 4 parters. The sarcasm shows just why Mr Interim has no interest in having volunteers as part of this organization? Continue to blame others. That’s the reason fo there being no money. Always being crafty with the funds and knowing more than everyone else. At least we have one thing in common by the looks of your posts. You don’t listen to us, and they don’t listen to you.
Anonymous 7:20pm. Chief disGRACE was no scapegoat. Nice try though. He went out quietly to save 2 firemen from being fired after the sexual harassment case. YOU DO KNOW THE TWO I SPEAK OF? Somebody knows!!!! When he should have been doing his job and not covering or better yet "fathering all his BAD CHILDREN" and yeah, yeah keep blaming director Weaver for everything wrong with your organization you seem really good at making people scapegoats. It seems you're doing the same to Weaver. Like I said man up and own it and stop blaming EVERYONE ELSE! As for Chief Nail I do believe he has "NAILED HIS OWN COFFIN" I really thought he was a lot smarter than that. Signed-- the cowboy who has a big fat wallet
Commissioner Bergosh, if ever there was solid proof of the discontent between these two parties at ECFR, this blog is it. The back and forth between these two groups is disheartening at best. The so called "Pros" claim of you only telling one side of the story is like the kettle calling the pot black, for god sake.Just read the comments here and it is as plain as the nose on your face that there is friction, there is belittling happening, there is only one narrative being told by one side then the other blasts away at the first. And this is not the only place one can see this disgraceful behavior between the two.
As a tax paying citizen, I deserve better than this from both sides quite frankly. I am disgusted that certain issues have been used to cry wolf, only to have them walk back the immediate need or change the import of that which was used as a trumpet for sounding the alarm of citizens being put in danger needlessly. What a shame, what a crying shame these people can't conduct themselves to the professional standards they claim to have......
Michael P McCormack
I have 15 years of being in the fire service, mostly volunteer and I retired as a Captain with all my time in Alabama. I have a little experience with Escambia County where we used to mutual aid with Innerarity Point and we were volunteers in Lillian. At the time we were both volunteer departments and we worked together seamlessly. I have nothing but good things to say about them and Myrtle Grove.
As far as working in a city fire department with half paid and half volunteer, I also had a good experience. Our Fire Chief started as a volunteer and became a paid chief. I think the fly in the ointment is the union. Even if I was a paid firefighter, I would decline union membership and this group looking from the outside inward is the union being the center of our problems and I talk about the public suffering from these antics. I am too old to volunteer and I love the fire service and even though I worked a salary job on the outside and worked over 60-70 hours a week sometimes, I still lived for the working fire, getting back to the station, washing hose, hanging it up and loading hose beds and preconnects. I did it side by side with paid guys and a spectator would not be able to tell the difference. On off time, volunteers and paid guys used to do things for fun outside of the firehouse and we were all brothers. Of course we had conflict sometimes but it was not over someone being paid or volunteer. Our equipment was equal quality of the paid guys and it was difficult to see the dividing line between the two. Our engine companies were either a paid company or a volunteer company and not mixed but the battalion was mixed. In fact there were several in the volunteer ranks that wanted to be paid to make a career and when one of our volunteers were hired, we were happy for them. I surely don't understand the problems in Escambia County but again I never worked beside a union firefighter but I have worked with union people in my regular work and I have had grievances made against me and went to arbitration which was nothing but playing games so I can imagine what goes on in mixed fire stations.
By the way, I have been out of the fire service since 2000 from my last volunteer position from Baldwin County, Alabama and before in Shelby County, Alabama. Since my last duty was Baldwin County, I would say the population is similar to Escambia County and the operating model in Alabama is quite different than here but each fire district is much more independent but still cooperates closely with mutual aid agreements. Since both counties have similar populations and perform the same service and also some of the departments are manned with union representation, I wonder if Baldwin County does fire protection much less expensive than Baldwin. I don't know but knowing how they are set up, I would guess Baldwin does it cheaper.... Just sayin'......
Richard Allison
Bellview
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