Late Friday afternoon Escambia County, through our attorney Troy Rafferty of Pensacola's Levin Papantonio Rafferty Law Firm, filed a complaint in the circuit court on the county's behalf. The purpose of the Complaint for Writ of Mandamus is/was to compel Clerk of the Court and Comptroller Pam Childers to once again resume payment of the 401(a) payments she has now unilaterally withheld as of the beginning of this year.
The complaint is very straightforward and makes the case very succinctly in a 30 page filing.
We will see what happens next.
32 comments:
"vo dee oh doh doh"
Even if you should prevail in court, I doubt this will be construed as a win in the court of public opinion.
Much like the majority of the U.S. population, your constituents are not eligible for any type of pension. This pension is obscenely generous.
I don’t believe that you commissioners are that popular. Escambia County seems to have a lack of money.
We are an incredibly popular tourist destination, but I don’t believe that the citizens are participating in the benefits from tourism. We seem to favor big developers at the expense of our great citizens. We continue to approve more and more enormous hotels, but we don’t seem to gain increased services. In fact, all we ever seem to gain is more traffic.
We don’t have the funds to replace the Bob Sikes Bridge - we raid that account frequently. Flooding is a problem throughout Escambia County. We can’t seem to stick with an Administrator for longer than two years. Our commissioners are frequently at odds with one another. And I have heard multiple commissioners, from the dais, insulting Pensacola Beach leaseholders when it is the county commissioners themselves who are responsible for the absurd tax structure on Pensacola Beach.
I don’t believe that the citizens of Escambia County are in favor of contributing $50,000 annually to your pensions.
If you would bring value to our citizens that would be another story. Your salary should be based on the value you return to the citizens. I’m not sure that a $50,000 annual pension contribution can be justified.
Tom--It is not a question of popularity--it is a question of process and following the law. If you take the time to read the complaint I have linked, you will see that with crystal clarity. As you know, I do not take this 401(a) plan. I am vested in the FRS pension plan which most government employees locally are also in. This said, we have to stay in our lanes as constitutional officers and zealously guard our responsibilities and rights---in particular our (the Board's) ability to enter into and meet the stipulations and requirements of contracts. This is our (the BCC's) power to do, NOT the clerk's. For her and her predecessors to pay on this contract since 1997 and then all of the sudden, unilaterally stop the payments was wrong, period. It is her acting ultra vires, in the opinion of many with whom I have spoken who hold law degrees. So to your point about what may or may not be "popular" in the court of public opinion: You are right--many elected officials are not "popular." What we do in making tough decisions isn't always "Popular." But I didn't run for and win this important position I now hold to be "popular" Tom. Most of those I have served with over the years both on the school board and on the BCC didn't run to become "popular." For you to look at it in such a condescending, juvenile way really misses the boat and the point. Remember one thing Tom: It's about doing what is right, NOT what is popular. Remember that.
One can Google and see other counties do this. This was one more of Underhill trying to make himself seem better than the other commissioners to the ones who still buy into his warfare. Also a clerk who doesn't know her job and the endless cycle of attornies loving the spoils of a post Facebook government with a newspaper getting his fodder from such also.
Truth is lies work in politics though.
Tom's part of the ECW group think mob.
It would be really great if this board enforced environmental regulations
People in #Wedgewood will not enjoy their retirement because they died from air, water and soil contamination because of zero enforcement. #fdep #departmentofhealth #concretechrushing
Shame!
Wedgewood again, those people died of old age and bad habits.
“Remember one thing Tom: It's about doing what is right, NOT what is popular.”
Jeff, that statement is ironic coming from you.
You frequently choose the politically popular route instead of what’s “right”. You and I both know that I could provide multiple examples, but I’ll refrain because I think that it would be a fruitless exercise.
I’ll concede that you might be technically correct in your academic dispute with the honorable Pam Childers.
However, it’s wrong for commissioners May and Barry to reap an annual $50,000 pension contribution. They don’t appear to be delivering a commensurate amount of value back to the great citizens of Escambia County.
Those two gentlemen went YEARS without even realizing that the annuity had a higher payout than the FRS - then they attempted to clawback hundreds of thousands of dollars. Similarly, they routinely make absurd economic decisions on behalf of our county.
I’ll further concede that you have a remarkable record of “wins”. Congratulations!
But, Mr. Commissioner, your “wins” rarely seem to benefit our citizens.
Ultimately, it’s not whether you win or lose, Jeff, it’s how you play the game.
In my humble opinion, you focus on politically expedient “wins” which frequently injure the great citizens of our county.
I would like to see you strive to do better.
Bergosh refuses to publicly acknowledge the elephant in the room. “It's about doing what is right, NOT what is popular.” Did you hear yourself? The right thing to have done was to address this from the start and change this plan. There is absolutely no way to justify a 51%, nearly $50,000 annual contribution for a part-time job. This is all about power. No… instead, the board is not going to allow anyone to question their actions and is willing to take this to court and force the clerk into funding those retirement accounts. I wholeheartedly believe one of the board members made these comments about Mrs. Childers in that hall. Called a "bitch" correct? Barry misrepresented himself in Tallahassee before the ethics commission. This is just an attempt to put this on the clerk and to remove the focus from these board members. This needs to be settled in the courts so it can be made plain these payouts are wrong.
Doesn’t the clerk , in her job , have a fiduciary responsibility to the citizens of Escambia County?
Bergosh is addressing the elephant in the room. We are governed by LAW not opinions stated as fact nor feelings. Or at least we are SUPPOSED to be. Pledge allegiance to the republic and all that.
However unfortunately "the vote", people on soapboxes and popular in facebook groups often is dominated by players swaying feelings and emotion rather than promoting intelligence and of knowledge of civics. Even here, you see people don't read it and still just stick to there opinion and feelings not based on facts.
Simply type in a search engine and one can even go directly to the IRS site and see a 401a is a qualified government pension plan.
There is an epidemic of stupid people.
True trying to get a back dated "payback" was also not expedient, especially with Underhill panting over the ethics sites wondering when his deeds will come to light and a perhaps a costly political error on the part of Barry and May since Underhill was getting all the info and passing it on to "be the ball" Arduini.
Also Gilley taking the side of Underhill in this was the last straw. Barry is the one who named her and jumped ahead of the FAC committee on the hiring of the administrator He winked at her and did the thumbs up during the hiring process. Her disloyalty to him cost her. It was the last straw but she was also doing a poor job. She seemed to get emotional also in her decisions and still had old GOB ways of doing things. She had the paramedics arrested when DOH had not moved on the complaints (because they were so frivolous and vindictive really).
But here we are.
Childers will probably lose this case. She was probably worried about the audit of her office though.
It won't hurt May because of identity politics and tribalism in D3 but Barry may suffer. Yet he can laugh all the way to the bank, I bet he did feel aggravated with himself that he didn't see the 401a sooner and filled out his paperwork too quickly prior. He shouldn't have hacked out the conservation protections in D5. Live and learn.
If I run and win D5 I'll take the 401a. Bird in the hand worth 2 in the bush.
Anonymous for D5..lol
This is interesting in the context of JLAC being here to audit the Clerk's and the County's handling of the TDC and any investigations/audits that stem from there.
While I didn't agree with the idea of retroactive payouts, and couldn't believe that the matter was being discussed in such a tone-deaf fashion on so many levels, the question is of course a legal one. And those of us who don't have to view things through a fog of disinformation understand that the taxpayer pay-in on the 401A is no larger than the pay-in on the FRS that, for instance, Underhill receives. UNLESS there is documentation otherwise, which has not been forthcoming from any corner I'm aware of.
Tom, why don't you ask the question of why the Escambia return is so much greater than that from the State's management? The answer to that question is more pertinent than continuing to proceed on the received notion that This Must Be Bad. Either the State does a miserable job of managing its FRS contributions and charges an arm and a leg for their ineptitude, the County is not administering the 401a contribution properly resulting in too high a return, or both.
The bigger ethical question per the County from where I sit is why they only offer this to their top rung leadership (and then wonder why morale is so horrible among its staff while having discussions of gutting benefits further down the chain).
Back to the Clerk's Office: the PNJ couldn't have picked a worse poster child as the fiduciary heroine than Pam Childers. You purport to be an information person, Tom, so here's a tip: research whose opinion at the City was responsible for the taxpayers getting murdered on the ill-advised Fish House suits.
In addition, Pam Childers considered herself excused as a constitutional officer from fulfilling her duty as Clerk to properly account for the drug enforcement LET funds. And then *publicly* made fun of the notion that it was important to track the back end paperwork on such things when I exposed it at the podium.
In addition, her office's most recent screw-up--one that she should have been personally financially responsible for--was pulling Matt Posner's pay from the wrong cost center, an error that was occasioned not by the County, but by the Clerk's office. Note that you won't hear Commissioner Bender, who was the TDC member at the time, spell that out from the dais any time soon; just as he did while he was assisting with EMS staff getting railroaded, he was happy to smokescreen away from Ms. Childers's error and rain retribution down on Mr. Posner's head, from his psychological safe zone behind female bureaucrats' skirts.
Every once in a while, Tom, you might want to push your community concern a little farther away from your own comfort zone, as well. It's really not that brave to spout ECW opinion on Commissioner Bergosh's blog. What I note is that you've never been one to challenge the status quo over there, even when I have in the past provided you with documentation that refutes their disinformation in black and white. Thank goodness nobody has to pay any attention to that forum any more. Blessings for humanity being few and far between these days, thankfully we've at least secured that one.
Real Question for
Jan 24 1:23 PM
What is the % contribution going into the FRS for County Commissioner?
Look it up and report back here. If you know how to get real information from the internet that is. Parrot.
Withdrawn candidate in D2 today. Too bad, maybe we will see him again. I was hoping it was Pino who withdrew when I clicked on it.
While we are veering off topic.. quick.. before it changes, How many shootings have occurred the last couple of days here? Getting out of hand.
A four-year old didn't have any bad habits, nor did his parents and grandparents, one of which ed died too.
And how chicken are you not to.show your face/name
http://escambia.floridahealth.gov/programs-and-services/environmental-health/environmental-toxicology/index.html#
Where have you been and do you not keep with relevant facts pertaining to this discussion. I'll wait for you to get out of class to respond.
Conspiracy! Conspiracy! All republicans are Qanon followers! DeathSantis is killing our children! Conspiracy! Conspiracy!
Haha the old ladies are having a shit fit over this on ECW with the PNJ article
LOUD FOR THE BACK ROW SEATS
51 % of commissioners salaries is contributed to both the FRS and this 401a. BOTH of them. The suit is to clarify the legality of the 401a AFTER the clerk ... all by herself ... stopped payment. Which most likely is wrong for the clerk. (against statute aka law)
Maybe you all at the BOCC should declare the Rafferty representation as a gift though.
Anonymous comments encourage some to comment hopefully without having the law on them called or sued or doxxed or pursued relentlessly or involved in drive by shootings because people don't like to be disagreed with politically. Rough bunch.
What the heck is wrong with people? Facebook commenters are the dumbest people on earth.
The PNJ reported that you all "sued" the clerk.
You filed a writ.
"writ of mandamus
noun
A writ that compels a government entity to perform mandatory or purely ministerial duties correctly.
an extraordinary writ commanding an official to perform a ministerial act that the law recognizes as an absolute duty and not a matter for the official's discretion;
used only when all other judicial remedies fail"
"Generally, such a petition for a mandamus order is made to compel a judicial or government officer to perform a duty owed to the petitioner........If the parties fail to comply with a mandamus order, they may be held in Contempt of court and fined or jailed."
mandamus
(man-dame-us) n. Latin for "we order," a writ (more modernly called a "writ of mandate") which orders a public agency or governmental body to perform an act required by law when it has neglected or refused to do so.
Can't believe the bandwagon of idiots commenting on facebook, well yes I do.
That bunch over on the opinion/chat/hate site love to spin around like whirling dervishes, throwing out ad hominems and opinions as if they are the factual experts on all things. It is quite amusing to watch them ricochet around in their very own echo chamber of hate, where all 8-10 of them just languish all day long, banging away at their keyboards in bitter frustration. LOL what a spectacle it is LOL
Doing the right thing escapes you 5!
Jeff Bergosh said: “It is quite amusing to watch them ricochet around in their very own echo chamber of hate, where all 8-10 of them just languish all day long, banging away at their keyboards in bitter frustration. LOL what a spectacle it is LOL”.
Is that an example of how you should spend your time, commissioner? Petty posts belittling your constituents?
You just recently claimed that your focus is on doing what is “right”.
We have legitimate problems in Escambia County in need of a solution. But you are picking fights with the Clerk while attempting to justify the actions of your two partners on the Board who have recently been spending their time attempting to clawback hundreds of thousands of dollars from the citizens of Escambia County.
If May and Barry don’t understand Escambia County’s pension plan, then what further county business do they not understand?
Additionally, there is (an unsubstantiated) story that you, May, and Barry called the Clerk a “bitch” and generally have been attempting to create a hostile workplace for Madam Clerk who is simply attempting to fulfill her obligations to the great citizens of Escambia County.
Strive to rise above your enormous ego, Mr. Bergosh. You have been a member of our school board and you are a three term county commissioner. You have an obligation to LEAD.
Set an example.
Jeff, why did you leave our the sexist language from your Complaint? Surely it is just as much hearsay as the rest of the filing.
Insert Ben Affleck meme.The one with his hands in his pockets and look of complete exhaustion with impossible people.
Pam is probably relieved to have this on file now.
They keep going. Arduini trying to get them to email you. He sounds like one of the 5th graders. The radio show one of them exclaims no one has heard 9f had its 450 th guest of the year and Mayor Robinson was the one Monday.
Taxpayer money is not spent on this. The abuse of power by the clerk should be called out.
Newsflash Tom. Read a shade transcript, commissioners cuss and even fart too. Some politicians even call reporters summbitches..who cares.
A county clerk does not have the authority to unilaterally make policy decisions. All this other squaking is of no consequence except causing problems from the Facebook crowd as was planned from Underhill from the beginning. Troll.
Begosh is leading. Read a link about civics law and government. He provided the info.
Try it.
So did the clerk issue the payment now into the retirement funds? 🤔 Seems pretty clear cut. (Unless one is a pot stirrer)
You do understand she's not making policy. She's enforcing the law. Geez. Another DA.
No she is not enforcing the law, She does not make policy and has no authority to do so. 514. You are the DA. And I DONT MEAN DISTRICT ATTORNEY.
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